Marla Saunders, an active reader here, commented on my last post and left some great questions. I thought the responses may be interesting to others as well. Here you go (questions in blue):
1. Can a church develop that “Epic Story” or do they need to have that heart to begin with.
To develop an “Epic Story”, one people are willing to commit their life to, begins with a passion in the heart of leadership. Leadership must be convicted this is what God has called the congregation to do. To build a covenant community, one that truly reflects I Cor 13 conviction can take years to build. Without the story born out of prayerful searching the effort will never be sustained long enough to build the deep trust and committed culture required to act on it. Thom Rainer, in his book Breakout Churches, found those breakout churches typically had pastors who had stayed the course 20 years or more.
2. How does a church communicate that missional vision? Who needs to have it (ie: church, people in the church, volunteers)?
The broader and deeper the church buys into a God given vision the more they will free “the spirit” to work in wondrous ways. And, the vision must be cast regularly with everything you do aligned with it.
3. Can a church third place be located solely inside a church (ie no outside direct entrance) and still be a vibrant part of a community?
Third Places can be a vibrant part of the community if they are located where people can conveniently stop by, and the church vision or story supports such a ministry. The “Third Place” must be a place of “connection”, not a place for “propositions”. Remember the atheist Matt Casper saying, first invite me into your home, then into your heart, before inviting me into your church.
4. What would you do if you saw a church heading down the coffee ministry path for the wrong reasons?
I believe we will answer for how we lead whether in our homes, church, or our businesses. I wrote the post yesterday out of conviction that we were not counseling churches effectively on what is required.
Can you help cast that vision to leadership? Yes, but to do so we must educate ourselves on so many issues related to culture, ministry, leadership, and facilities. That’s a part of what provoked the creation of CKN.
And don’t the words coffee ministry just kind of sound like a bunch of ladies in the church basement?Coffee ministry – Sounding like old ladies in a church basement? Yeah it kind of does doesn’t it. Never thought about that.
Thanks Ed! Great answers. I’m just praying through a lot of those questions, and yet don’t know why exactly. Our church is in the middle of building a life center that has a coffee bar in the middle of it, a natural outgrowth of the personality of our leadership. I’m called on once in awhile to offer an opinion, but not as much as my passion would seem to indicate. Usually that means God has a new “assignment” up his sleeve when I get passionate about issues. Time will tell! Pray with me if you think of it.
Question 3 asks if a church can have a cafe inside with no direct outside entrance and still be a vibrant part of the community – ABSOLUTELY. But not without excellence and exceeding expectations on every facet of the third place. All five senses must be engaged, quality of product must meet or beat the national average (not hard to do by the way), the customer service must be generous in help and kindness, something lost in today’s retail marketplace (trust me, it too five stores to buy one item today, mostly due to people not wanting to help), and you have to put all of those together, combine them with a reputation for service and community, and then trust in viral marketing.
Churches need to contribute or add-value first to the communities. A successful third place that is set up as a cafe, has the opportunity to produce a positive revenue that can be poured back into the community. That’s just one of many ways to give back even when you’re deep inside the physical church.
Oh – and have you ever gone to a place that was amazing, had a great reputation, but was in a poor location? I have, and it reminded me of this very topic – - – churches in suburbs and cafe deep in churches can contribute, but they must be so insanely good in all areas that you just have to go there and have to tell someone who tells someone who tells somone who………well, you get it.
What is I saw a church using coffee for the wrong reasons? I’d call some of the bouncers from The Church Bartender protection agency and have their grounds and brewers removed.
Ed could not be more right (okay, maybe if he tried just a little harder) – when he shares of the need to educate pastors better. Greg Snider from the Aspen Group said to me on a drive in Chicago, “Michael, we must continue to have better conversations earlier in the process.” That is happening more and more and it is making a HUGE difference.
I believe we are giving churches better chances to succeed from the beginning than we ever have, but there is still more work to be done. Helping churches understand the OPPORTUNITY they have in all that a third place can do and resonding to the RESPONSIBILITY the church has to maximize every resource.
Finally – I’ve started to challenge pastors and churches who have cafes to list them on their websites and other media right alongside Worship Services, Children, Youth, Senior, Cafe – - it is a ministry – one that when set up properly, Contributes to the church, the community, and to the Kingdom – it is not, or should not, be one that is in competition, but one that compliments.
Church Bartender, that’s good stuff there. You answered some of my unasked questions. The whole concept of casting a vision early is in the process of the coffee bar being a ministry within a ministry seems important to me. It may have, for instance, its own outreaches, its own “regulars” and its own personality, independent from its sister ministries in the church.